Date: 2020-04-28 07:54 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
Да, надо мысленно ввести поправочный коэффициент.

Date: 2020-04-28 07:59 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] misha-b.livejournal.com
The flu is roughly at 30k (and that was a bad season, if I remember correctly). Coronavirus is already twice as bad after about a month. Even if it flattens now, it is going to be 5-10 times worse at least.

Date: 2020-04-28 08:24 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
Посмотрим. I'm on record predicting 100,000 deaths give or take a factor of 2 before anything started in US. Официальный прогноз сегодня: 74,073
https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america
что меньше чем смертность от гриппа в 2018. Это конечно нечестное сравнение яблок с апельсинами, но всё же.

Date: 2020-04-28 09:14 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] shvarz.livejournal.com
Как вообще можно этим предсказаниям верить если у них прогнозируемая кривая смертей выглядит симметрично до и после пика? Хоть в одной стране такое наблюдается? Ну, может быть более-менее в Китае, хотя и там не очень. После пика смерти на спад идут очень медленно.

Date: 2020-04-28 09:36 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
Я вообще-то не говорил, что я им верю. Если вы можете подсказать какaя модель сегодня считается consensus best, то я буду смотреть на нее.
Edited Date: 2020-04-28 10:02 pm (UTC)

Date: 2020-04-28 10:48 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] shvarz.livejournal.com
Не знаю какая лучшая, но точно не эта.

Date: 2020-04-28 10:57 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
Может они все такие?

Date: 2020-04-29 12:35 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] shvarz.livejournal.com
Скорее всего. Моделировать можно естественный процесс который протекает сам по себе, а тут столько всего зависит от принимающих глобальные решения и от поведения людей. Грубо говоря, завтра весь карантин отменят и новые инфекции скаканут вверх, какая модель может такое предсказать?

Date: 2020-04-29 02:59 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
Это совершенно справедливо.

Date: 2020-04-28 09:59 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] misha-b.livejournal.com
I think your numbers are a bit off -- flu deaths in 2017/2018 season were about 61000 (https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden-averted/2017-2018.htm#table1).

74000 for the whole year sounds absurd. We are at slightly under 2000/day right now, so we will be there in less than 10 days at the current rate.

Date: 2020-04-28 10:00 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
These are not *my* numbers and this is not my forecast either.
Edited Date: 2020-04-28 10:02 pm (UTC)

Date: 2020-04-28 10:03 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] misha-b.livejournal.com
> что меньше чем смертность от гриппа в 2018.

You said that, no?

Date: 2020-04-28 10:12 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
Раньше они говорили, что 80,000:

https://www.statnews.com/2018/09/26/cdc-us-flu-deaths-winter/

Date: 2020-04-28 10:20 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] misha-b.livejournal.com
I see. I guess they revised the numbers down.

Date: 2020-04-29 12:20 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kodak2004.livejournal.com
95% UI 46,404-94,987

80 тысяч укладываются в него и сейчас.

Date: 2020-04-29 02:26 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] alexanderr.livejournal.com
so, it's just like flu, right?

Date: 2020-04-30 01:30 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] alexanderr.livejournal.com
what is the key difference? coronavirus death rate of 0.1% is similar to flu, no?

Date: 2020-04-30 02:44 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
The key difference is very strong dependence of mortality on age.

Date: 2020-04-30 02:53 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] alexanderr.livejournal.com
is that why there's never a flu quarantine? different mortality by age, while similar total mortality?

Date: 2020-04-30 03:54 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
No, that's because regular flu ends on schedule and this one seems to be not.

Date: 2020-04-30 04:07 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] alexanderr.livejournal.com
covid-19 data on nyc.gov shows very clearly that this is over.
at least in NYC. cases, hospitalizations, deaths, everything is back
to mid-March levels, i.e. low

Date: 2020-04-30 01:03 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
To the extent that it is "over", it is so largely due to the measures taken. As opposed to the regular flu that goes away on its own.

Date: 2020-04-30 02:18 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] alexanderr.livejournal.com
officially 25% of NYC residents were exposed. that's based on random testing, looking for antibodies.
so with measures we get 25%. without measures we get 100%. was it worth it?
more importantly, do we need to continue with the measures? what would be the point of that?
unofficially, I think the real number is closer to 50%. since they tested only active adults,
no children, but included children in the total population. plus, the tests are not that accurate yet.

Date: 2020-04-30 03:26 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ny-quant.livejournal.com
Ответы на вопросы зависят от выбора метрики оценки результатов. Каковы допустимые экономические потери за одну спасенную жизнь?

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